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  #1  
Old 29th August 2007, 04:42 AM
M4rc0 Offline
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Thumbs down [solved] why is it so hard to install fedora with vista ?

Hi all,

I have 2 sata hard disks, one with windows vista and another one that i want to install FEDORA 7

i downloaded and burned the 64 version and i'm very frustaded with the problems

i didn't know the instalation would be so difficult

the vista HD is the sata1 (boot) and the other HD is sata2

-first try, it installed, i choose to boot normally (from fedora hd) but nothing happened
i guess it's because the boot order that got vista loaded

fine, i researched the forums here
i tried the following (with rescue disk)
chroot /mnt/sysimage
grub-install /dev/sda

and i encounter "does not have any corresponding bios drive"

-fine fine..i read more about it and it was suggested to resintall and choose the other hard disk to install the grub
done, this time vista menu appears..with no linux...

worse, after "leaving this to fix later" i noticed that the vista menu disappeard too

-i even tried changing the sata positions so it would load the grub
it appeared, but it didn't work, neither vista or fedora

i'm getting disappointed, is it that hard to work with 2 hard disks?

Last edited by M4rc0; 7th September 2007 at 03:12 AM. Reason: solved~
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  #2  
Old 29th August 2007, 07:41 AM
brr872002 Offline
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Once again boot in rescue mode
chroot /mnt/sysimage

$vi /boot/grub/device.map
# this device map was generated by anaconda
(hd0) /dev/sda

post the result
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  #3  
Old 29th August 2007, 03:30 PM
M4rc0 Offline
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that file is blank when i open with vi
so i supose it doesn't exist

i guess it's rigth no? because i choose to install in the windows hd
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  #4  
Old 29th August 2007, 10:01 PM
stoat Offline
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Hello M4rc0,

You probably want to proceed and brr872002 has not returned in a while. I sort of got lost in your first post as to your original intentions (GRUB to be installed in MBR and boots Vista and Fedora? GRUB to be installed in the Fedora boot partition and Vista boots both? Have drive cables been switched?). From your first post, I concluded that you want to install GRUB in "the master boot record" (meaning the Vista drive's MBR) and have GRUB boot both operating systems. Many people do that. If I have misunderstood, I apologize. Maybe some clarification would help. But if I have that right, then return the drive cables and BIOS boot order to the way they were when Vista booted and Fedora was installed...

When you ran that grub-install /dev/sda command, you were very likely targeting the Vista drive's master boot record for GRUB. As I said, many people use that method. If that is what you are trying to accomplish, try this before worrying about the device.map file...
Code:
grub-install --recheck /dev/sda
It's just like the command you tried when you got the BIOS drive error message. Adding the --recheck option causes grub-install to probe for your devices instead of looking for a device.map file. After probing devices, it will install GRUB and then rewrite (or write for the first time) a device.map file. Using it may allow GRUB to reinstall when you run into that BIOS device error. If it doesn't work to install GRUB in the master boot record of /dev/sda, please return, and if you can, post the results of these two commands in linux rescue...
Code:
/sbin/fdisk -l
cat /boot/grub/grub.conf
IMPORTANT: You should have a Vista installation disk handy if you are trying to install GRUB in the Vista drive's master boot record. It would be needed if you decided to reinstall the Vista boot code there, or undo any of this, or recover from a disaster.

Last edited by stoat; 29th August 2007 at 11:37 PM.
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  #5  
Old 30th August 2007, 06:05 PM
M4rc0 Offline
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hi stoat!

i'll try to clarify

i have 2 SATA HDs, one with VISTA and the other one that i want to have Fedora (until i realize it's haaard, im about to get back to noobuntu)

so far i tried 2 instalations, that is,
-i installed fedora, and in the initialization part i choose the first option, wich is to make grub in the fedora hard disk
-> it didn't work, because here it boots from sata1, and i can't change in BIOS, it only shows as a boot option "via VT6420 1st HDD" wich is the hard disk in the sata1 controller, get it? that's why i mentioned the cables, sorry if i didn't explain well. So to boot from linux, to check if the grub will show up, i changed the fedora HD to sata1 (was and is in sata2 rigth now) and it didn't work

-second try, i resintalled again and in the initialization part i choose to boot from the other OS this time, VISTA
-> it work, the menu showed up but no linux, just "choose your operational system: VISTA"
and after a few reboots, one or two the boot disappeard, probably because it's only vista detected somehow

that is my situation, about the stuff you asked:

Code:
grub-install --recheck /dev/sda1
grep: /root/grub/device.map: not found
/sbin/grub: not found
just in case i did a fdisk -l, tried with all and all of them 'not found'
by the way, this is my fdisk -l output, maybe helps to clarify even more
Code:
/dev/sda1 * NTFS
/dev/sda2    W95 EXT'D (LBA) <- what is this? anyway..
/dev/sda5    NTFS

/dev/sdb1 * LINUX
/dev/sdb2    LINUX LVM
have 2 ntfs, C: for windows, D: for files, kinda off topic
linux lvm i supose it is the swap partition

then i tried the rest you asked
Code:
/sbin/fdisk -l
/sbin/fdisk: not found

cat /boot/grub/grub.conf : not found
from what i see i don't have GRUB installed, but like i said, in my actual instalation (the second that i explained up ahead) i choose to boot from windows

this time i changed sata to see what happens if i try to boot linux, the grub shows up and i noted the options to tell you here:

Code:
fedora-fc7xen
fedora-base
other (should be vista)
from each option:
Code:
booting 'fedora-base (2.6.21-1.3194.fc7)'
root (hd1,0)
filesystem type unknown, partition type 0x7
kernel /vmlinuz-2.6.21-1.3194.fc7 ro root=/dev/VolGroup00/LogVol00 rhgb quiet
error 17: cannot mount selected partition
press any key to continue...
Code:
botting 'fedora (2.6.20-2925.9.fc7xen)'
root(hd1,0)
filesystem type unknown, partition type 0x7
kernel /xen.gz-2.6.20-2925.9.fc7
error 17: cannot moutn selected partition
press any key to continue...
Code:
booting 'other'
rootnoverify (hd0,0_
chain loadar +1
GRUB
*freezes here and i reboot, changed back the sata cables, and load vista typing in this forum :)*
i'm sorry for my english and clarification, anything just ask
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  #6  
Old 30th August 2007, 06:09 PM
M4rc0 Offline
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i think i'll have to resintall
that is fine if i don't miss something in the initialization part, it's complicated

i think the better way is to boot grub from the linux hard disk/partition, but i don't know how if it's in the sata2, it should work someway
or if i change to sata1, and grub shows windows vista to choose would be fine

switching cable orders is not a problem
and i have the vista disk don't worry


thanks again for the help

Last edited by M4rc0; 30th August 2007 at 06:20 PM.
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  #7  
Old 30th August 2007, 06:47 PM
stoat Offline
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Hello again M4rc0,

What you want to do is a very common thing: Windows on one drive with Fedora on another. It really shouldn't be causing all of this trouble. You have my sympathy. If you intend to reinstall, I recommend that you consider a dual boot method commonly known as Jim Lawrence's method that is specifically intended for your hardware scenario and plans...
Quote:
Jim Lawrence's Dual Boot Method (paraphrased)

There are many methods to dual boot Fedora and Windows. This one is particularly suited for when the operating systems will be installed on separate drives, and the user wants to avoid altering the Windows drive in any way. The method involves unplugging the power cable from the Windows hard drive, setting the other drive to first in the BIOS boot order, and installing Fedora on that drive with GRUB installed in the master boot record. After reconnecting the power cable to the Windows drive, a tweak to the file grub.conf is needed to get GRUB to boot Windows. The advantages to this idea are 1) it usually works, 2) the Windows drive is not altered in any way, and 3) it can help remove confusion in the user and GRUB about where to install things. The method follows below and was paraphrased from Jim Lawrence's Wiki which is off line a lot and why I wrote this.
  1. Windows is installed and working on the first drive in the BIOS boot order. A separate drive is intended for Fedora.

    NOTE: Jim Lawrence's instructions in the wiki specify that the Windows drive be on the primary drive cable (or channel) and the Fedora drive be on the secondary channel. But this still works even if the drives are on the same drive channel. It also works with two SATA drives.

  2. Power down, open the computer case, unplug the power cable from the Windows drive.
  3. Power up, enter BIOS setup, set the Fedora drive to first in the BIOS boot order. Leave it that way.

    NOTE: If your BIOS doesn't let you change the drive boot order, I have done this by using the master & slave pins to change the boot drive. I have also successfully done this method with both drives as masters on separate channels and swapped the primary & secondary cables to change the boot drive. Do that kind of work while powered down in step 2.

  4. Install Fedora allowing GRUB to be installed in the master boot record. Reboot and finish the initial Fedora setup.
  5. Power down, reconnect the power cable to the Windows drive.
  6. Power up, enter BIOS setup again to confirm the Fedora drive remains first, continue booting into Fedora and edit the grub.conf file...
    1. Open a terminal
    2. Become root with su -
    3. Open grub.conf with gedit /etc/grub.conf
    4. Add these lines:
      Code:
      title Windows
      rootnoverify (hd1,0)
      map (hd0) (hd1)
      map (hd1) (hd0)
      chainloader +1
      NOTE: Change hd1 in the grub.conf code above as needed. It is the GRUB syntax for the Windows drive. If more than two drives exist, it could be something other than hd1.

    5. Save the grub.conf file.
  7. Reboot and try booting XP from the GRUB menu.
P.S.: Don't install that xen version of Fedora unless you need that.

Last edited by stoat; 26th October 2007 at 03:37 PM.
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  #8  
Old 31st August 2007, 04:28 AM
M4rc0 Offline
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hello stoat,

but you have to agree that doing that can be a bit trouble, it should just install and work, no big deal
it's not my itention to compare, but i did with ubuntu and worked

now according to that method, before i try it i have a few questions:

Quote:
Jim Lawrence's instructions in the wiki specify that the Windows drive be on the primary drive cable (or channel) and the Fedora drive be on the secondary channel.
The important thing is to set the drive intended for Fedora to first in the BIOS boot order and leave it that way.
1) it says bios drive order, and channel drive order:
-Windows in primary in the channel, but not in bios;
-Linux in secondary in the channel, but primary in bios;

in my case, the order of the boot is decided by the sata channel, like i posted before
at bios it shows VIA VT6420 1st HDD <- that means channel 1
(VIA VT6420 is the mainboard sata controller, not the hard disk)

so you sure this method still works with me?
i can't put primary for linux beeing on channel 2

2) how can i NOT install xen? it just did.

thanks again!
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  #9  
Old 31st August 2007, 12:19 PM
stoat Offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M4rc0

but you have to agree that doing that can be a bit trouble, it should just install and work, no big deal
it's not my itention to compare, but i did with ubuntu and worked
I don't mind if you compare Fedora to something else. I didn't create it. I'm just trying to think of things to help since the insert-disk-and-install-system thing didn't work for you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by M4rc0

so you sure this method still works with me?
i can't put primary for linux beeing on channel 2
No, I'm not. But I have done this with IDE drives on a machine with an older board that didn't allow BIOS drive order changes. I did the drive order change by switching master and slave. I would still try the method by making the drive for Fedora first by switching its SATA socket before installing and leave it that way. It would take only a few minutes to find out, and it wouldn't make your situation any worse to try.

Quote:
Originally Posted by M4rc0

how can i NOT install xen? it just did.
I didn't say that you can't install it. I said don't install it if you don't need that version. People often install that without knowing what it is, and it can lead to unnecessary complications. Maybe you need it.
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  #10  
Old 31st August 2007, 12:42 PM
M4rc0 Offline
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Alrigth, i'll give it a try

i'm sorry for my english as i'm not american, i'm brasilian

so when i said 'how can i NOT install it', i meant,
i didn't want to install, it just did, and i don't want to install it
so i asked you how can i not

you got it like i said i wanted to install or something
when i asked exactly what you said about installing without wanting it, thats why i capsed the NOT

my apologies!


i'll try that out and give the reply here later

thanks again³³³
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  #11  
Old 31st August 2007, 04:56 PM
stoat Offline
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Hello again M4rc0,

I just repeated my experiments with the Jim Lawrence method using two IDE drives in a test computer that doesn't allow selecting the drive order in BIOS. First, I had the drives on the same drive channel (cable) and used the master and slave pins to switch the Fedora drive to first after installing Windows XP on the other drive. It worked. Next, I put the drives on separate channels both as masters and then switched the drive cables between primary and secondary to make the Fedora drive first after installing Windows XP. It worked. I edited the post above to add a clarifying note about this issue.

I don't have two SATA drives to test your exact situation. But the correlation between two master IDE drives on separate channels and two SATA drives on separate channels is very strong in my mind. I feel certain that if you follow Jim Lawrence's method but switch the SATA drive cables as the way to set the drive that is first in the boot order, it will work too. Additionally, I have read posts in which people have done this with SATA drives. I hope you at least try, because you could then return and post your results establishing whether it will work or not. I, for one, would like to know.

Lastly, about the xen thing: If you don't plan on needing virtualization, don't install the xen kernel. I believe that just means don't select Virtualization in the Base Group during installation. In fact, why not just try a default package set while you are teaching yourself to install this? For now, don't select any additional packages, don't add repos, etc. You can add additional things later. Or, if you happen to need software development packages and server stuff, reinstall Fedora again with those after you have this installation/dual boot issue straightened out for your machine.

You have my best wishes for success.

Last edited by stoat; 31st August 2007 at 08:15 PM.
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  #12  
Old 1st September 2007, 01:34 AM
M4rc0 Offline
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Thumbs up

And....*drums*...it WORKED!

I knew i was in the rigth path when i saw Fedora loading so beautifuly
Did exactly like the tutorial, sata1 linux, power off windows on sata2, install, power on, change grub.conf

I can't be thankful enough stoat
Persons like you is what inspires persons like me to seek community and keep the project beautiful

Thanks again

how about any moderator change this topic and put a nice [fixed] before the title?
it's usefull for 2 hd SATA users

cheers!
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