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  #1  
Old 25th March 2012, 06:48 PM
farqad Offline
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What do YOU want to see in your next Fedora?

Hi,
I just wonder to know what Linux users want in their Linux distribution...
Probably, if I could choose (don't worry, I can't), I'd like a Fedora a little more user-centric.


First of all, I'd like something that allows me to easily find software (look at their screenshots, comments and ratings) and install them in one-click, such as the Ubuntu Software Center or (even better) the Google Play market.
I actually prefer to use my time using software rather than installing its dependences!
I would like it not only as an user, but as a developer as well. In fact, in my humble opinion, a software market/store could attract new third-party developers and companies. (above all, if it will be also open to paid software...)

The same concept, in my poor mind, should be applied for drivers. I'd like something like the Device Driver Utility of openSolaris, which provides information about the devices installed and enables you to download and install (graphically and in one-click) the drivers for those devices that don't have an attached one.
Moreover, I'd like a way to easily/automatically install (also during the installation as in Ubuntu) the more used codecs (such as .mp3) and the Flash player.

Last, but not least, I'd like BTRFS as the default File System in Fedora with a Nautilus built-in feature that would allow me to easily access to the BTRFS snapshots, as well as the Solaris Time Slider does with the ZFS snapshots.


...and you? What do you want to see in your next Fedora?!
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  #2  
Old 25th March 2012, 07:38 PM
jpollard Online
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Re: What do YOU want to see in your next Fedora?

I would like real support for SysVinit scripts...
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  #3  
Old 25th March 2012, 11:45 PM
Dutchy Online
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Re: What do YOU want to see in your next Fedora?

Nice topic and well motivated wishes too!
A software market like program would be nice but first they need to speedup RPM (personally I don't mind using the CLI or packages kit but I do not like the waiting).

What I really want is an improved SELinux sandbox.
One that has a simple GUI and runs graphical programs safe and easily.
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  #4  
Old 26th March 2012, 07:35 AM
ozjd Offline
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Re: What do YOU want to see in your next Fedora?

Quote:
Originally Posted by farqad View Post
Hi,
First of all, I'd like something that allows me to easily find software (look at their screenshots, comments and ratings) and install them in one-click, such as the Ubuntu Software Center or (even better) the Google Play market.
Have you seen this - https://admin.fedoraproject.org/pkgdb/
Not everything you ask yet but is a start. I think it is still in development which is why it hasn't been promoted.
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  #5  
Old 26th March 2012, 08:04 AM
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Re: What do YOU want to see in your next Fedora?

I just wanted to mention a few things because threads similar to this one have come and gone many times before:
  • Keep in mind that the Fedora Project's mission statement makes it clear that the distribution exists to lead and to improve free and open source software, not to be user friendly (but that's not to say that the two can't both happen)! I just wanted to point out that the first and foremost goal of the project is to drive technology forward, as opposed to make it the friendliest possible.
  • Developers do not monitor this forum so even if a request has X many votes by users please do not feel like the developer community is ignoring its users. A few packagers (such as myself) do happen to frequent the forums, but generally the Fedora developers do not check the forums often, if at all.
  • Fedora is entirely a community (and volunteer) effort, so in a sense it is already 100% user-centric! Features are only incorporated into Fedora if someone is willing and has the time to make the changes. The sad truth is that most of a developer's time is spend in coding new features and bug fixing; little is left for documentation or user experience improvement. This is where you can help! Feedback is always appreciated through the various communication channels such as Bodhi (for package testing) and the mailing lists (discussions).
  • A simple way to install drivers has not and will not ever be available. Fedora enforces a strict policy of distributing free and open-source software only, and any software that is tangled in patents or has licensing restrictions is rejected. It is unfortunate that most proprietary drivers and media codecs fall under this category, but that's how it is and why efforts like Livna and RPM Fusion were started. Naturally, Fedora cannot endorse such projects so we won't see a system where they can be easily installed in a few clicks directly from the system UI.
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  #6  
Old 26th March 2012, 08:55 AM
Evil_Bert Offline
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Re: What do YOU want to see in your next Fedora?

It must have been years since I last had a dependency issue in a Fedora release. That's not to say that someone, somewhere hasn't had one recently, but I haven't heard of one. Of course, if you are looking for obscure apps from obscure repositories, you may encounter difficulties.

As far as codecs and a range of other add-on programs goes, simply install the RPM Fusion repo - that'll give you just about everything you need (I've never needed more in many years of Fedora use). Even easier - use AutoPlus.

IIRC, there was (and maybe still is) a proposal floating around for a Fedora "app store". I think I've already posted about it in this forum ... somewhere. Edit: here it is: http://forums.fedoraforum.org/showthread.php?t=265242
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  #7  
Old 26th March 2012, 09:57 AM
farqad Offline
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Re: What do YOU want to see in your next Fedora?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Firewing1 View Post
  • Keep in mind that the Fedora Project's mission statement makes it clear that the distribution exists to lead and to improve free and open source software, not to be user friendly (but that's not to say that the two can't both happen)! I just wanted to point out that the first and foremost goal of the project is to drive technology forward, as opposed to make it the friendliest possible.
I really can't understand that point. Obviously, the mission of Fedora is to improve open source software, but make it simple and usable is a necessary step to improve it (a necessary step, not only an useful one).
In my humble opinion, drive technology forward means also drive technology to people. Having a really advanced technology that most of users can't use is totally useless.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Firewing1 View Post
  • Developers do not monitor this forum so even if a request has X many votes by users please do not feel like the developer community is ignoring its users. A few packagers (such as myself) do happen to frequent the forums, but generally the Fedora developers do not check the forums often, if at all.
[*]Fedora is entirely a community (and volunteer) effort, so in a sense it is already 100% user-centric! Features are only incorporated into Fedora if someone is willing and has the time to make the changes. The sad truth is that most of a developer's time is spend in coding new features and bug fixing; little is left for documentation or user experience improvement. This is where you can help! Feedback is always appreciated through the various communication channels such as Bodhi (for package testing) and the mailing lists (discussions).[/list]
How can be 100% user-centric if not even developers monitor what their users think about! (I was just kidding with your words... )

Let me take a step back. For many aspects I love Fedora (and for that I thank you guys). But, honestly, I really can't understand why for many open source developers the user experience is a taboo. Open source can be easy, efficient and also cool (e.g. Mozilla Firefox and Thunderbird). User experience is not only a feature, it is an absolute killer feature.

Android is one of the most advanced mobile OS and it is based on the Linux kernel but, nevertheless, it is damn easy and cool. And, perhaps, also for this reason it's so used and so advanced.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Evil_Bert View Post
It must have been years since I last had a dependency issue in a Fedora release. That's not to say that someone, somewhere hasn't had one recently, but I haven't heard of one. Of course, if you are looking for obscure apps from obscure repositories, you may encounter difficulties.
What I mean is that, for example, to have Skype on my 64 bit Fedora I have to install the dependences first (e.g. alsa-plugins-pulseaudio).
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Last edited by farqad; 26th March 2012 at 10:10 AM.
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  #8  
Old 27th March 2012, 10:44 AM
tuguix Offline
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Unhappy Re: What do YOU want to see in your next Fedora?

I wish i could install fedora on old machines, i mean why do i need 768mb of ram to install fedora with LXDE, XFCE or any other low end desktop. Some say fedora is 100% user friendly, some now call it LSFRP (Linux system for rich people. Me just feel sorry i have to run my server outdated with fedora 14.
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  #9  
Old 27th March 2012, 12:00 PM
beaker_ Online
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Re: What do YOU want to see in your next Fedora?

Quote:
Originally Posted by tuguix View Post
I wish i could install fedora on old machines, i mean why do i need 768mb of ram to install fedora with LXDE, XFCE or any other low end desktop. Some say fedora is 100% user friendly, some now call it LSFRP (Linux system for rich people. Me just feel sorry i have to run my server outdated with fedora 14.
Why? You can and should use either CentOS or SL instead.

Quote:
What do YOU want to see in your next Fedora?
The question should be; what do you want removed from Fedora. But it's often easier just to do it myself rather than complain about it.
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  #10  
Old 27th March 2012, 04:28 PM
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Re: What do YOU want to see in your next Fedora?

i want implementation of words what they mean
for example
delete should mean delete and not ctrl+delete
shutdown should mean shutdown and not another window appearing.

there are many such simple wishes but i think answer lies with gnome and they are not going to listen. ( i have tried with gnome develpoers and they replied also but at the end it amounts to no reply at all.)

recently linus torwalds also complained regarding requirement of root password for simple tasks in opensuse. Therefore general trends appears to make things more difficult. (sorry for rant)
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  #11  
Old 27th March 2012, 06:35 PM
William Haller Offline
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Re: What do YOU want to see in your next Fedora?

I'd personally like a 12 month freeze on new features till they get the existing ones fully working and bug free and all the old code has a chance to catch up. I could go into the specifics, but I'm sure you can all supply your own.

I know that's fantasy land, and everyone new to the software that installed it and so far hasn't been bitten thinks this is crazy talk, but it would be nice to get some stability for a change. Works most of the time without crashing on random hardware profiles and usual user loads isn't really good enough when at the same time you are trying to provide enterprise based software for the product.

One of the features on the list to be added in 17 is cloudstack (if it makes it anyway - at 60% the last I saw). If you want to provide "enterprise-ready" software, you need to at some point step back and get your system enterprise ready. This isn't an RHEL/CentOS vs. Fedora question. Even RHEL has gotten a bit spotty of late, but nothing like Fedora. If you want to provide enterprise ready software for people to use, you'd best get your ducks in a row first. If not, then spend some more time getting the basics working before spending time implementing grand cloud solutions. That was just one example, and not intended to denigrate that particular software package at all - just an example that was handy.

Yes, I know the devs don't read this and ranting is pointless, but it feels good once in a great while!

Mr. Pollard's comments are but one example of things that were working, got busted, and have yet to be fully made operational again.
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  #12  
Old 27th March 2012, 08:04 PM
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Re: What do YOU want to see in your next Fedora?

Some more tools for configuring things on LXDE and XFCE. Both of these are good alternatives to Gnome/Gnome-Shell, but both lack some basic tools to make life easier such as a menu editor or a keyboard capslock/numlock indicator for or a keyboard status indicator for keyboard layouts that won't lose its settings when the system is suspended and resumed.

While LXDE has the keyboard status and capslock indicator applets, one must download and compile a Java menu editor to have any graphical means of editing a menu in LXDE. LXDE also lacks a working power manager. One can use XFCE4's power manager, but its icon in the status window does strange things like shifting further and further right as one suspends and resumes, leaving a lot of unusable space on the panel. One can have the xfce power manager running and then use the lxde battery indicator to show the state of charge, but this seems to be soemthing that could readily be addressed. LXDE also lacks a keyboard layout tool which is available in XFCE and Gnome (probably KDE too, but I don't have it installed to check). It makes things somewhat difficult when one needs to set up and use different layouts such as polytonic Greek and biblical Hebrew keyboards in addition to the English keyboard.

One can say that these items should be addressed to the developers at the XFCE and LXDE sites. So they have. However, it would be nice to see fixes for these in the next Fedora release. One can always hope . . .

It would be kind of nice to periodically have a long-term support release so that those who want to be adventurous can do so while those who want to take a breather from the 6 month cycle can do so.
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  #13  
Old 31st March 2012, 11:48 AM
farqad Offline
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Re: What do YOU want to see in your next Fedora?

As I said that I'd like a tool for managing BTRFS snapshots in Fedora, I discovered that there is one, called Snapper, in openSuSE 11.2.

http://en.opensuse.org/Portal:Snapper
http://lizards.opensuse.org/2011/04/...ucing-snapper/
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